Win Today
Win Today is a performance enhancing podcast filled with actionable insights and inspiration to come out on top in life. Through captivating interviews and solo episodes, a powerful tool is created and given to listeners to be able to push through any situation in life.
Hosted by Ryan Cass, he delivers messages that align to his purpose of helping people establish a foundation for sustained success, break trends of adversity, and chart desirable courses for life. Win Today!
Win Today
#224 | Melding An Ironmind: Rowing Across The Atlantic & The Hidden Value In Pushing Your Body Ft. Damian Browne
What happens when the ocean tries to break you? Within hours of launching his solo Atlantic row, Damian Browne—former professional rugby player turned world-record-holding adventurer—was seasick, cramping, and drifting backward. Then he caught his thoughts and asked three simple questions: What are you here to do? How do you do it? Then do it. That mental switch became the blueprint that carried him thousands of miles across the Atlantic, completely alone and without a functioning rudder.
In this episode, Damian unpacks the Ironmind philosophy—the mindset system that turns fear into focus and suffering into strength. We explore the Four Controllables he teaches at the Ironmind Institute: body position and technique, breath, effort, and self-talk. Through real stories from the open ocean, Damian shows how to re-enter the present moment when chaos hits, and how voluntary adversity builds self-trust, self-respect, and resilience.
You’ll also hear about his next mission: a run around Ireland to raise one million euros for charity—with open community miles each morning so others can join the journey. This is more than a story of endurance; it’s a lesson in how to lead yourself when everything else falls apart.
Connect with Damian:
ironmindinstitute.com
@auld_stock
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Keep in touch below!
And I just had this moment, like this moment of self-awareness, where I I recognized the destruction that I was heaping onto myself. And that moment just gave me enough of a gap to say, just sit down for a couple of minutes and get a bit of space, right? So I sat down on the seat, still pitch black, still waves everywhere. And I asked myself three questions. So, what are you here to do? Row the Atlantic, but how do you row the Atlantic? And my answer to myself was, Well, you fucking roll. That's it. And you're not rowing. Like, and what isn't what good is another minute or hour or six hours or a day spent here kind of lamenting everything that's gone wrong and feeling sorry and asking questions. And that doesn't do anything. If you want to row the Atlantic, that is fuck all good to you. So I just started to roll. I rode for seven hours without coming off the oars, seven hours straight, and I I made 10 miles. Um put that in context, if you rode on in average conditions for seven hours, you'd probably make 25 miles. So I was going basically nowhere. I took 45 minutes off to see if I could get some food into me and hold it down because I hadn't eaten in about 20 hours. Um I was able to get a shake and then I rode again for another seven hours.
SPEAKER_01:Do hard things, help one person, be good and do good. Live a life of discipline, and you'll always win. You have all the tools that you need to succeed. Welcome to Win Today.
SPEAKER_02:Thank you so much for tuning in. My name is Ryan Cass, and I'm your host. My purpose in this world is to help push people further and harder than they believe possible and become unshakable in what matters most to them in their lives. Every week, you're going to learn from either myself or renowned experts in their field, and we're going to unveil pieces of our playbook to help you win today. Please, if you love this show, subscribe and share it with somebody that will benefit from it. Let's dig in. Life is a fight. That is the philosophy that our incredible guest possesses. And if anybody knows how to get through a fight, it is Damian Brown. He has fought countless battles as an Irish pro-rugby player, as a Guinness World Record holder that has challenged his limits rowing across the Atlantic Ocean multiple times, most notably from New York City all the way to Ireland. And as the leader of the Iron Man, Iron Mind Institute, where he teaches people how to build unshakable discipline and become relentless in the pursuit of their goals and ultimate dreams. Damien, it's an honor to have you on the show and thanks for joining us all the way from Ireland.
SPEAKER_00:Brian, thanks for having me. I appreciate the invite. Great to be here. So it's shifted a little bit over the years. Um for many years it was um to quote the famous Delphic inscription on the walls of the temple, um, the Apollo temple, know thyself. So it was about figuring out who I was. And I can I can look you straight in the eye here and say, I went to the depths of my soul to find out who that person was. And I'm not saying that has finished, it hasn't. I I will always be driven to go further internally and externally, to explore internally and externally. However, uh more recently in the last maybe three, four, five years, I feel that there's been a kind of a shift towards service within me. Um and you know, from my own readings, I understand that is part of you know self-actualization. Um yeah, I've I've I've put a lot of time now into using what I've learned, um, sharing what I've learned, trying to pass that on to the best of my ability so others can hopefully um access new frontiers within themselves, access new um ways of experiencing life through um pathways that I've cut myself just by putting my head down. And with great grit and tenacity and belligerence and drive, kind of found a way to get to where I am. You know, it's not been pretty, um, but I suppose that's the point, right? Um uh or that's where the real good stuff comes from, is from the ugly side, from the shadow stuff. So so yeah, that's that's where I'm at right now. I really want to I want to um want to use what I have discovered to impact others, and I feel if I impact them well, um the world will be a little bit better, you know, a little bit better place. And uh I could I could die in the morning happy knowing that that's what I spent my time doing.
SPEAKER_02:I appreciate the the humility that comes out in how you said all of that. And for us extreme adventurers and the ones that I get the opportunity to speak with that really want to draw the best out of others, as you said, but not just draw it out of them, but do so by exemplifying you going on the journey yourself, leading by the way. What's the genesis of that for you, Damien? What cultivated this sense of adventure and never-ending pursuit to really see what do we have inside of us?
SPEAKER_00:I could I'll tell you a story. Um so I was 15 years old, I was watching the Rugby World Cup. Uh so rugby union is is my sport, it was my sport, and I was um I lived about 10 minutes from my local rugby club. Most of the kids around the streets that I lived on um played up in the rugby club, which is called Goegion. So I'm 15, I'm I'm I've been ignited by this sport, you know, I love it, but I I I this moment is the one where it just takes off. And I'm watching um the All Blacks, Ireland versus the All Blacks, the first game of the 95 World Cup, and Ireland score first, like the Irish rugby team back then are not the Irish rugby team they were now. So this was totally unexpected. Like I was off the couch with my father screaming, you know, Ireland are beating the All Blacks in the first game of the World Cup. Anyway, the All Blacks come back and um and dominate for the next 75 minutes or whatever it was, and uh most of that domination was by uh a winger called Joan Alomu, and I remember just being absolutely transfixed by this kid. He was like four years older than me at that point, he was 19 years old. He was a he was about 265, 270 pounds, uh Maori boy, uh Polynesian boy, and he just was like taking the world by storm. He was running over half the Irish team, and I just remember like it was Bohemut, like and I that was my kind of ignition, I suppose, point. And then um a couple of years later, obsessed with rugby at this point. I'm coming off my school's rugby season, um, not having played a game. So that's like the equivalent of you know, um uh the I had one more year left in high school, one more year left in secondary school, as we call it here in Ireland. Um, so um at that point in your life, like I wasn't particularly academic. Um I learned through doing, I learned through sport more than anything, movement, I suppose, play. And um, and now here I was coming off my school. The thing that was most important to me in life, and I hadn't played a minute of a game, and I I just had this um moment where it all hit me, like it all the reality of it all coursed through me, and I felt all of this deep negativity, like embarrassment, um, disappointment, shame. I felt like this deep shame because what I had seen was somebody who was just acting like a waster, you know. And um, it was that moment where I somehow was able to kind of funnel those emotions, uh as matter as kind of deep and dark as they were on my very um youthful mind. I was able to funnel them into a decision that changed my life, and that decision was, or the question I asked myself at least was well, what are you gonna do about it? What are you gonna do about this? You didn't play a minute of the year of rugby this year with your school? Well, what are you gonna do about it? What what's the problem here? And the problem was I was overweight, I wasn't fit, I was lazy, I was um I wasn't doing the work. So I didn't know much about like you know, it's not like today where I mean you could get a full training program at the touch of a button. Um back in this was 1997, so all I knew really was that people go run um if they want to get fit. So I went up to Gowegians, walked up half eleven at night. I went up at that time because I was embarrassed to be seen. That's how this is how this is what this experience was to me. I didn't I wanted to do it, but there was this wrestle inside me. I didn't want anybody to see me doing it because I was I was ashamed of the place I was at. But half eleven at night went up. It was a manky night pissing out of the heavens here in Ireland, like stormy, and uh I I ran around that pitch for two and a half laps, and every step was basically there was resistance, there was like stop, stop, stop, but I persevered for two and a half laps. That's how one fit I was, and then I was back the next night, and the next night, and the next night, and I was back every night for like about 30 nights straight. I ran um laps around that pitch, and and that was that was the genesis of it all. That was where I learned the value in the work, the value in pushing yourself. The because every night I walked back to my parents' house, I felt a little bit better about myself, I had a little bit more confidence, I had a little bit more respect for myself, I had a little bit more belief in myself, and every night I I walked down, I had the same feeling, and I couldn't, of course, at the time I didn't know I wasn't able to say any of this, I didn't understand it, but I could feel it, and it was driving me back, and it was that decision that decision to do something about um something that was within my control, so it was to take responsibility for my fitness and go and do something about it. So that that was just that was the genesis, that was life-changing because with responsibility brought commitment, with commitment brought work, with work brought the ability to persevere. Um and through all of that, then there was just these amazing rewards. So I was I was rewarded internally, you know, through all those things. You know, I started to trust myself, I started to believe in myself, I started to respect myself, I had a uh um an increase in the worth I felt. I was actually I wasn't this person who should be ashamed. I was I was more right, and then externally I had amazing I had amazing rewards because I actually started to play some good rugby, and so much so that I went in a span of two years, I went from not playing for my school, which is uh under 18s, right? Not playing for my school to playing senior professional men's rugby inside two years, and that was just because I got fit. Um it was just because I went and ran laps, and I didn't give up on myself when I ran those laps, and I didn't I didn't um withdraw because of the feelings I felt, the resistance, the weakness, the doubt. I didn't I I I had I had made a decision and the commitment to that decision just drove me past all of that shit. And that touched me so deeply that you know I've I've made up my life. I've I can't now it was reinforced and reinforced and reinforced all through many, many years. Like firstly, the challenges of professional rugby, and then challenges I started to set myself. The same thing was reinforced, you know. You every time you do something really hard, that's incredibly difficult and brings states that are you know hard to get through. Uh you have these, you have the the equal, the rep reciprocal rewards. And um, so when I kind of came out of professional rugby, I was still exploring myself for a little while, but it then it came to a point where, right, well, you know, as Louis Simmons from West Side Barbel said, don't be a Ronin. You know, a Ronin is somebody who has all this knowledge who doesn't share it, whereas the samurai shares it. So don't be a Ronin, share it. So that's what I've that's what that's where it's kind of stemmed from.
SPEAKER_02:Wow. So going all the way back to watching the all blacks play with your dad against the Irish national team to then I would say perhaps even while you're experiencing that moment, you saw yourself on a pitch like that someday, yet the work you were putting in didn't equate to creating that opportunity yet. Uh one of my favorite books is Legacy, and it's about the all blacks. And I have a I have a big bucket list uh for life life experiences and a lot of sporting events too. And even though rugby's not uh big here in the States, I I really appreciate the the aura that it that it has in Europe and I wrote down to go to an all-blacks game someday just because of the tradition of discipline and camaraderie. I love that after every game that they clean the locker room, they clean the stadium, and that's just who they are and what they do. And thinking back the what you said about the work is really beautiful because nobody can escape doing the work. We can hope and wish and dream and see ourselves on the pitch of a big title game, but if our work doesn't amount to, or rather, if our work doesn't equate to to that, it's just gonna stay a hope and a wish and a dream. Was there a particular day or moment, Damien, where you know you're you're taking these nightly runs, you're getting better, you're starting to create this sense of belief in yourself, you're seeing some outward recognition. Was there a particular moment where then you flip the switch in your mind that you're like all right, I've got this? Or is that something that maybe didn't take place in your mind? It just you just kept doing the work and good things started happening.
SPEAKER_00:The power of responsibility cannot be overestimated. It's an extraordinary choice to make. Um and and that moment where I decided that I took ownership of the situation, that's where it all changed. So that that's the hardest thing. It's it's getting around to truly making that decision. It's almost all downhill from there. Then you just gotta go and do the work. Like, but that but that once you've once you've made that decision, the work becomes something different. It's not a chore, it's uh it's a pathway. And the kind of deeper you go, the further you go on that pathway, the the more enriching and enlightening and empowering the experience of the work you're doing. So it becomes this beautiful um this beautiful kind of circular um uh path of rewards, you know, the further you go, the more, the deeper the experience you get. So so that was the thing that drove me more than anything. I never really remember a point. I just remember that the these um the the experience been so rich that despite what I felt during it, there was no way that I was not going to go back and go again and again and again. Um now the the fact that I um I I started to gain some sort of um recognition um because of the work, like that very much helped. I think when you're a when you're a man and or a boy at this point I was, but the same thing stands like when when you start to be looked up to by your peers, like your your teammates, because of the uh impact you're having on the team and the game, like that's a that's an intoxicating feeling. Um so that so that that that also played into the momentum, I suppose, I had that like you've found this way of living, and it's accelerating the more you do it, the more you want to do it because of that kind of momentum that's building up from the rewards that you're getting because of the work you're putting in. And um and in a in a way I've never really stopped. Um you know, I I do I do stop for periods as such. Like if I come off the back of a big adventure now, I I I give myself time and space away from that way of living, it just wouldn't be I don't it would it, I mean it's an intuitive thing, but you know, it doesn't wouldn't make sense either if you thought about it logically um to to be jumping back into it because it's it's an incredibly demanding way of living and it's incredibly pressurized. Um you know, when you we get to the end of a a big, big, big challenge that you know was was true challenge at all of the elements of genuine and true challenge, you know, the the last thing you need to be doing is rolling back into another one of them. So it's not like this incessant, well, I suppose in a way it is quite incessant, but it's not like I never stop. There is pockets of time and windows of time. But generally, I you know, I built that mindset. I built uh I built that um uh I built my kind of operating beliefs during those 30 nights and over the years have continued that just deepened and deepened, and I still operate in all those same places, those same beliefs, those same mindsets that that were first kind of created in those 30 nights running around the pitch.
SPEAKER_02:A lot of your adventures that you seek out and complete today take you very far distances in lengthy amounts of time, days, sometimes weeks, even months when you're thinking through the next adventure that you're gonna go on. What does that process look like? How does someone go from playing rugby to then deciding to row across the Atlantic to climb Mount Everest to compete and complete the world's hardest running race across the Sahara Desert, fully self-supported? What does that look like for for you and how do you ultimately then choose okay, that's the thing that I'm gonna go and do?
SPEAKER_00:When I was playing rugby, um again, it comes back to the responsibility piece. So when I was playing rugby, I took full responsibility for my training, my preparation, and my performance. Um and that meant that I had this um focus on those things. I I was going, I was I wanted to be better. I I've always had this mindset of furtherance. How can I be better? What do I need to do? Um, and that mindset, that curiosity brought me outside rugby. Like, so I can have a good view of what everyone in rugby is doing. I'm I'm training in these environments every day, but what are other people doing and how can I use that to be better? So uh throughout my career, I was you know reading a lot. Uh, it was kind of before there was podcasts and um audiobooks on these things. So I was I was doing a lot of reading, be it magazines or books on adventures, on what people were doing to train. And that was a that was quite a spectrum of like uh of um methodologies. So I was into like looking at what the bodybuilders were doing to put on more muscle, looking at what the best power lifters in the world were doing to be stronger, and I was looking at what the best endurance athletes were doing to endure, and I was like, Well, how can I use that to be a better rugby player? So through that kind of uh curiosity, I discovered like that there's people, there's a race in the Sahara Desert where people run for six days, 250 kilometers self-supported. I was like, whatever. I I don't know what it was, but there was a deep draw, there was a deep knowing in me straight away. It's like I'm gonna do that someday. Um, I've I read a book about uh two British um adventurers, one Ben Fogle is his name, TV presenter, and the other one was uh an ex-Olympic rower, James Cracknell, called The Crossing. The book is called The Crossing. And this is the first time I found out that people row across the Atlantic, and I was like, wow. So I I I found these things during my rugby career, and I almost put them on a list, like I put them in a kind of cognitive box like that for I'll open that after rugby. Um, so as I kind of got closer and closer to the end of my career, um, those things started to come more and more into my attention. And um, you know, when it was clear that I was going to retire, um, that's what I wanted to do. I I I kind of I had prepared for about seven or eight years to give myself a window of time post-rugby to explore those things. Um, and when I mean prepare, I mean prepare financially. So I just started saving like money, putting a uh um a percentage of my wage away every month, so that like the only thing I knew was the you might want to roll across the Atlantic, but it costs a bunch of money and nobody's gonna pay you to do it. So I was like, well, you bet if you want to do it, you better be prepared, right? So so that's kind of what it looked like. Uh I I gave myself a five five years. Um, and speaking of goals, uh you know, through the your rugby career, like you kind of institutionalize to set goals. So you'd be setting everything down to daily goals to to um yearly goals. And I had um I had goals lists at that point when I was retiring that I went back to and referred to, and they were one-year goals, five-year goals, and lifetime goals. And from rereading those, I I made a new goals list and I entitled it. I was 35 at this time, I entitled it before I am 40, I will. And I had seven endings to that sentence. Before I am 40, I will complete the Martin de Salah. Before I'm 40, I will row across the Atlantic. Before I'm 40, I will um climb five of the seven summits. Before I'm 40, I will uh raise a hundred you 100,000 euro for charity. So um and this was that window. So I gave myself a five-year window. I said, I'm gonna do these things, that's all I know. I want to do. I'm I'm I'm compelled to do them, I'm I'm heavily drawn to do them, and I'm ready to try. So um so that that's kind of how it all came about, uh, from pro rugby to extreme adventure.
SPEAKER_02:And everything that you wrote down on that piece of paper is now a reality, right?
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, well, I um of the seven I got around to attempting five of them. I completed four or so. Um, and then the other two that I didn't even get a chance to is the time frame thing more than entonces. You know, I think we always think we'll we'll do more in a time frame than I mean this comes I see this daily in myself. I'll do that, that, that, that, and that. And I get that, that, and that done, right? So it was the same thing, it was the same thing with the the five-year goal. Like that I I had basically too much um on it. Um, and then uh yeah, I haven't gotten back to them yet because subsequently became a father, and and so one of you an example. One of those was I wanted to cycle the Pan American highway from the tip of Alaska to um Bushuya in Argentina. Um, but I I I wasn't doing it for the the goal with that wasn't any type of performance piece, it was um it was the adventure, the travel, the intoxicating nature of the freedom of a bike and stopping where you want and going where you want and seeing I think there's the I think there's the guts of like 23 countries along that Pan American highway. So so that was going to take a couple of years, and I was gonna try and climb the highest mountain in um North America and South America, so Denali and uh Acankagua. Um at the same time. I I got to both of them, I I climbed both of them, but not during the cycle, if you get me. So uh so it's that like that it that would still be something I'd love to do, but um different phase of life right now.
SPEAKER_02:Hearing you say all of that excites me. Like this is my kind of jam right here, and I know some folks that are listening are I'm thinking of some particular good friends right now that are ready to go jump on board with you. And as you were saying that, I thought through I love the adventure you took across Cambodia, I believe, where you bought a$50 bicycle and just found your way through Cambodia, and then how you also went through Iran literally couch surfing. So I love how your adventures not only rather I love how your adventures extend in in some cases beyond the extreme endurance realm and really exploring uh curiosity. And I and I hear that is a theme as you're as you're speaking and just researching what you've done. I want to highlight the row across the Atlantic for for a little bit and get you to share that journey because I know that that did not come without its fair share of curveballs, of unwarranted surprises. If I'm not mistaken on day 17 you lost steering of your vessel, you lost a rudder. I listened to a podcast on day 31 where you were woken up by a 330 meter ship that was coming your way. So I'd love if you could put us in the put us in the seat for a little bit with that adventure and some of the challenges and learnings that you had on on that experience.
SPEAKER_00:Well I'll start by saying there's no challenge like an ocean row it is just um otherworldly in um in what it demands of you and the strength you have to find to get through it. So you row oceans in this oak ocean rowing craft um they're roughly seven meters about 21 feet long um about two meters wide um so about seven feet wide and it's got two cabins on either end so one of them is your you know it's your refuge from the madness outside and uh in between and then on the other side there's a small little storage cabin and in between there's an open rowing deck. And um yeah by manpower alone you try and get across uh whatever body of water you're you know endeavoring to cross and I had uh discovered um that there's a race that takes place every year across the southern North Atlantic so from the Canary Islands to Antigua and the Caribbean um called uh at that time it was called the Talisker Whiskey Atlantic Challenge and uh um there was something extraordinarily compelling um for me in that I was just like obsessed with this undertaking I think there's something really beautiful about doing something by manpower alone something that is um you know of a different millennia you know that just like there's so many other means of doing it now but there's something really pure and free and beautiful about doing it yourself just by manpower alone. So um so I had no clue like when I first um committed to this undertaking I had like zero idea of really what I was going into because I had no maritime experience no real rowing experience even though we do a lot of we do a lot of row work on the indoor roar in professional rugby especially my position it keeps you off your feet we do call it off e conditioning so less wear and tear in your body so I knew I was I was decent at the on the indoor roar um but I had never been in a a rowing boat I'd never been in an ocean rowing boat and uh the third element of me being completely out of my depth excuse the pun was I couldn't swim I still can't swim so um so you know you would uh you would think that I would stay away from ocean rowing rather I kind of I I I rushed towards it um and just figured it out right I just I had no clue but I worked it out as I went and I tried not to look stupid in front of people who knew a lot more than me you know I was a bit of fake it till you make it and I felt like an imposter most of the time but if it means enough to you you figure it out and you find a way to make it happen. So uh so yeah I I joined this race and I prepared for about 19 months. So um I suppose my wheelhouse is in the physical and mental side of it like that's kind of my background and and and that's my purpose and passion. And then the technical side I just had to learn as I went and um and eventually I got to the start line um uh a very determined individual like um to the point of delusionment where where I was in a race with 25 other boats um I was a solo so there was five man boats four or five person boats four person boats three person boats pairs and then at the back of that fleet was um five solo rowers um and I delute like I said delusionment I thought I could actually win that race um so um because I knew I knew like technically I'm the best rower like as in like I can like I I I'm I'm I can go on those indoor row machines like there's nobody beating me but it's it's got little crossover to the actual act of rowing an ocean um but I took off out of the blocks uh I was the last boat to leave from the Canary Islands so they leave kind of in five minute intervals and I just got the luck of the draw that I was the very last boat to leave. But it just heightened my determination and I took out of the I went out of the blocks first six hours I pulled past about four boats and then I had this weird kind of um situation where the thing I've relied on my whole life like the thing I have absolute trust in is in my body and then it just started to shut down around me at that point and I was like completely taken like by surprise I didn't know what was happening. I got seasick I got um blisters on my hands and on my ankles I had this weird like very very strange cramping in my lower limbs like it was it felt like cramp and it was a type of cramp but I was getting it in like the both muscle groups so the antagonistic muscle group so the like quad and hamstring were cramping at the same time it didn't it made no sense like so I had this very weird um and very disturbing point in just in like six well it was maybe seven or eight hours after starting that my body was shutting down like and I didn't couldn't understand it and I put like 19 months of everything I have into prep and I could see the whole thing kind of falling down around me. And just at that moment as well the tides and the winds changed so the tide started to go in and the wind started to blow back to the um the islands so all of a sudden I was getting sucked back to the islands for now I was not only was my body shut down but I was had this kind of situation where the boat was getting pulled back so it seemed like the whole thing was just going to go down in flames um there and then and I was so discombobulated I was I had very I struggled to make sense of it all but I I I said to myself so you can keep rowing but you're not going to give yourself a a moment to um you're not gonna give your body a moment to hopefully have some level of recovery or you can go and sleep for a little bit um but then you're gonna get blown back further. So that's what I decided to do. I just slept um 45 minutes on the alarm clock got up I've been blown back a mile um like that might like now that I've I've kind of spent a lot of time motion rowing like that's nothing but at the time it felt like I I 100 miles I was like disaster um so hopped back on the oars I made um a mental point to get back to which was uh where I where I had been which was a a certain distance to waypoint so it was 48 point 48 point three kilometers or miles to the next waypoint which is how you plot your way across the ocean basically coordinates so at that point I was whatever I was a mile back 49.3 so I said I'll get back to where I was and then I'll put out the thing called power anchor which is like a an anchor that holds you in place in the middle of storms um so I'll put that out because it'll be night time then and at least I'll I'll have a I'll put my head down for the night and tomorrow's a new day right like this fucking shit show will be over hopefully I'll feel better and then we can see what we can do about day two on day two. So uh got back to that point. Took me three hours rowing into those tides and into the wind to get back to where I was uh before I went to sleep put out the power anchor something I'd actually never done before um just a strange series of events within my preparation I'd actually never done it like I'd done the theory that's it um so put that out and then went to sleep and woke up five hours later so woke up at about five in the morning and looked first thing I did is look at the GPS and I've been blown back two more miles uh a mile and a half two more miles so like I and it was went outside it was howling the wind the waves were getting pushed over the top of the boat and I'm pulling in this power anchor going what the fuck am I going to do like I I felt a bit better at least physically but mentally I was completely completely gone like I was completely compromised completely fragile no I had no um anchor I was just my mind was everywhere and it was all negative like and it was coming at me from every angle you know I could nearly I could see faces of people I knew who wanted me to fail or at least that's the story I was telling myself about them right this is this is what was happening in those those dark moments literally and uh figuratively as I kind of pulling in that power anchor um moment like this moment of self-awareness where I I recognized the destruction that I was heaping onto myself and that moment just gave me enough of a gap to say just sit down for a couple of minutes and get a bit of space right so I sat down on the seat still pitch black still waves everywhere and I asked myself three questions so what are you here to do row the Atlantic well how do you row the Atlantic and my answer to myself was well you fucking row that's it and you're not rowing like and what is in what good is another minute or hour or six hours or a day spent here kind of lamenting everything that's gone wrong and feeling sorry and asking questions and that doesn't do anything if you want to row the Atlantic that is fuck all good to you so I just started to row I rode for seven hours without coming off the oars seven hours straight and I I made 10 miles um put that in context if you rode on in the in average conditions for seven hours you'd probably make 25 miles so I was going basically nowhere I took 45 minutes off to see if I could get some food into me and hold it down because I hadn't eaten in about 20 hours um I was able to get a shake and then I rode again for another seven hours so 14 and 15 hours um and I hadn't gone far but I'd gone far enough in that time to get the winds had died and the um to get out of the tidal current where it kind of starts um or well where it's stronger. So I'd gone far enough and then I was just able to get away because of that 14 hours work that I did um and and the the moment I can I can I can see I can or I know that the moment that that race became a success rather than a failure became a success rather than it did not finish was it when I saw my destructive thoughts when I had the awareness to identify and recognize them because um that gave me the space to sit down the space to sit down gave me the quick um um time to ask myself three questions that were able to direct me uh and then I just did the work um and there was two other boats going through the exact same thing I was going through so uh backwards forwards two other solos and um all I know about them is that they didn't roll for 14 or 15 hours on uh did morning of day two and into the rest of day two and uh and they never got they never got out they never got past those tidal currents and winds and their races were their races were over they ended up um getting pulled back into the island after three days of battling these winds and these currents so um so that was my baptism of fire into this extraordinary adventure that came ahead that as you said brought you know on day 14 I had um a double capsize um in a crazy storm that actually ended up ending the race of two other boats as well where they were capsized one of them had a fire on board so I was capsized twice during that storm it was absolutely like crazy levels of kind of chaos um on my second capsize I was outside on deck I ended up getting um pushed into the water when the boat was capsized by this giant wave and just before I got into the water I grabbed onto a handle on the bulkhead of the boat just on one of the cabin faces and I held onto it underwater as the boat went full 306 well 180 degrees underwater and I was just hanging on to the boat with one hand going squeeze your grip squeeze your grip and I got kind of lassoed out of the water by the self-writing of these boats they're designed to self-write so it was it was just an immensely crazy day as you said a consequence of that was I had um complete complete malfunction of my um steering system so about three days later that thing finally cracked and broke and and unless I had a welder on board I wasn't going to be able to fix it so um I had to row the final well the 2000 miles 2000 nautical miles just with I had to steer the boat um with the oars because I had no other way my tiller my rower my um um my uh rudder was gone couldn't be used um and look I was already rowing an ocean in what they call a traditional shaped ocean rowing craft so um it uses there is more modern shaped ocean rowing boats that use the wind more but it didn't that doesn't align with my values so I I didn't choose that I chose a traditional shaped boat with foot steering only so some of these boats have autopilots have um I I went as raw as you can go and now here I was in a traditional shaped boat with no steering so it it became like 10 times harder like it's just you have to try and row the boat then with the oars or sorry steer the boat with the oars and it's incredibly difficult. Anyway I I I did what I did and I I kept going basically I kept going I kept rowing I kept answering that question I asked myself well how do you row an ocean you row you row you row right and you keep rowing and if you keep rowing and something I've learned and it's a really it's uh it's the most simple thing that ocean rowing taught me but it's the most righteous thing is uh wherever you want to get to in life it doesn't matter if you can point yourself in the right direction and never stop so in this case never stop rowing you'll get there you'll get there as long as you can direct yourself and you never stop pulling on the oars you'll get to where you want to get to it's the exact same thing in life um and that's what I did that's what I did after 63 days uh I ended up getting to Antigua without any um without any uh steering system and it was extraordinarily difficult I ended up getting like in a severe case of pressure sores and seesaws because when you have to steer with the oars you're moving around a lot on the seat and if you're not cleaning yourself diligently which I wasn't um you start to get the the salt crystals start to like you know get into your skin and you get the see the seesaws and then the pressure sores just from sitting down for so long every day and it is like Chinese torture. Like there was moments around the 40s like somewhere around 40 that I I have videos of myself like shouting into the phone like because the doubt was big around then because sitting down for 10 minutes was excruciating.
SPEAKER_02:I'm like I need to sit down for 12 hours a day and row this boat like I can't even sit down for 10 minutes how the fuck am I going to get it Tantiga um you know a kind of necessity breeds invention ended up kind of creating this like perch that I put on my seat that was uh like a bunch of um yoga mats that I had glued together and then they raised me up enough and then I was able to cut out holes where I had the pressure sores in the yoga mats just to give them some space so I wasn't sitting on them directly and that helped me kind of get to a point where I was able to sit down for 12 hours a day and anyway got the boat Tante I don't give short answers sorry no i i was mentally watching you on the boat and I'd love for you to share more about just how unrelenting the ocean is so we've got the context of you've been pushed back a couple times and you've lost your steering you've been capsized but talk through what what are we dealing with here do we have do we have 10 foot 12 foot waves that are that are crashing to our to our left and right and front and back and what what type of sound is the ocean making what is it are there any other signs of life are there the occasional cargo ships or is it just you and an unrelenting mother nature that is just pounding you all day long so it's a bit of an white knuckled experience when you're on deck like so when you come out of the um cabin the first thing you do is you clip into the boat.
SPEAKER_00:So you have a basically you're wearing either a climbing harness or a life jacket and you clip into one point of contact with the boat because you just never know when a wave is going to come they call them rogue waves um see just never know when a point at that point you know you could get unlucky and it could get a rogue wave and it could capsize the boat so anytime you're on deck it it is white knuckled you're hanging on basically um now there is calmer days and and the ocean is um she's moody so she has her moods like but generally she has a she's has a a level of challenge within her that you have to pay alert attentiveness to and if you don't you are risking a lot so so you you cannot be lazy out there like you can't be um you can't relax it's just way too dangerous um and you have to be very attentive and very clued into what you're doing and very present and there's there's something beautiful about that in itself um and it ranges from flat cam to 30 40 foot waves so like I have this image that I will never get out of my mind of um being um just seeing these rollers like walls of ocean like coming along like I could see them as far as I can see right and as far as I could see left I could see these walls of water and then they'd come and they're big bulbous things right so I'd just go up the face up up up up up up and then over the top and then I'd see another one coming and about 15 seconds later this big huge wave would come and up over that. So that was a that like I I've spent 170 odd days nearly 180 days on ocean running boats and that's the only time I've ever seen that it's just like absolutely mind blowingly beautiful and um unique um and then um you have the chaos of a storm like where you know it's just like the wind is howling like ferociously and the the waves are um roaring I suppose they're grumbling and groaning and when you're in the cabin in a storm um the noise you you're so alert right because you're you're just listening because you know the sound of a wave that potentially could capsize you it it hisses so like it the wave will break at a certain um space a certain um distance from the boat and then the the power of the break will hiss along the top of the rest of the ocean and you're listening for that type of um potential wave that can potentially um capsize you and when you're listening you put um if you hear a coming you put out all fours when you brace in the cabin for the turn um and then you can see like low like on the on the more southern route you have um beautiful clear skies most nights so if you look up into the um like I've been in the middle of the Sahara there's nothing like the middle of an ocean like the middle of the Sahara is spectacular but it pales in comparison to the middle of an ocean like there's so many stars in the sky on a clear night in the middle of the Atlantic that when you look up you can't focus on anything because they they all start to slightly shimmer there's so many of them they're just this like sheath of shimmering stars just and you can't actually like the the the cletter the trillions and billions of them you can see they kind of all join together into this sheet of like shimmering mass it's absolutely extraordinary um so you can have moments like that and then you know you can have kind of on the North Atlantic I'll probably get to it but you know you have much a lot more fog like I I I can I can remember times where although I know I'm alone I know there's not a ship within three kilometers of me because on my radar it says there isn't but I feel claustrophobic because I'm caught in this bubble of fog like just around the boat like I can only see 10 meters that way 10 meters that way and like you almost feel like I I I might hit something even though you know there's nothing there to hit like so yeah all sorts of different experiences and we in terms of wildlife you can have everything from you know the bird life to um I had the the the privilege of many whale encounters including sperm whales um and pods of dolphins like every day I reckon about 50 days straight on the North Atlantic I had either um a couple of dolphins or a full pod by the boat like every single day is and and these moments are indescribable in how important they are to you like then the the the um explosion of the experience of connecting with animals in a million miles from a ticket boot right a million miles from like somebody charging you to do it like it's just in their natural habitat and their curiosity is bringing them to you and that's that's the same with whales a couple of sharks um dolphins sea turtles um yeah like beautiful moments that's as primal as it gets you talked about the three questions that you asked yourself when it was getting really tough and you know how do you how do you row across the Atlantic?
SPEAKER_02:Will you frickin' row as you've encountered those similar moments and other challenges and things that you do and even if you were to go into the future into another challenge you may be taking on with your actually into this one million lap challenge around Ireland that you'll be doing next year. When you reach these moments what is your typical process or what questions are you asking yourself then? Are they the the same three just instead of how do I row from here, how do I run around Ireland will you freaking run? Or do you have a different process that keeps you moving forward?
SPEAKER_00:Yeah I I've um I created a methodology around this um from you know years and years and years of exploring it and and pushing um pushing my body for more and and and you know through that exploration and human guinea pigging almost realizing that it's always the mind that um that creates the problem. It's always the mind that is the barrier it's not the actual body so um you know in a in a nutshell what you want to what people want to be thinking about when it comes to like these these moments of doubt and negativity that come up through physical challenges the first thing you need to do is get out of your head and into your body so you need to redirect your attention out of um the um story that it's telling you the narrative the the um the mental um conversation and you need to reconnect it into your body so so the mythology I call the four controllables basically that there's four actions that are always within your control no matter what the situation no matter how deep the despair is no matter how negative and dark and destructive the the conversation is if you can become aware of that conversation you can change your experience of what you're experiencing so I'm I'm um having a really bad day on the oars and all I'm thinking about is how many miles are to go how many miles I've done um how many days this is likely going to take me so that that's that conversation is a a consequence of where I've let it go to right I've become outcome oriented I've let my focus go to the outcome and anytime you're focused on an outcome the outcome is not within my control it's not within your control it will never be within any of our control anytime you're focused on an outcome you're going to be negative there's going to be an uh a subjective experience that is going to feel negative and you can change that uh you can change it by concentrating and focusing on an action that's within your control so hence the four controllables so the first one is body position and technique that's always within your control so in case of if say I was running my body position and the technique of running those are always within my control so I can try to redirect my concentration to a part of that a specific part of my body position or my technique and to do that I have and and just so we're getting into the kind of full um um the full view of what this method is to do that I'll have what I call pre prepared my awareness so I'll have uh mental resets that are it like I've readied them for this moment because I know this is coming right so so I'm not going into This um experience by chance. I know these are these are part of challenge. Like you're if you're if you're not getting them, you're not pushing yourself. So um, so they will come up and I'm ready for them. I'm I've readied my response. I've readied my response with what I call a mental reset or a mental anchor. And what those do is they lead my mind to an action that's within my control. So um uh an example of a body position and technique one would be so if you are um if you're running, it would be body language. So just saying to myself body language, it just puts me the minute I say to myself body language, it just I I automatically move into a better body position. And once I've made that connection, so I've gone from an external thing into okay, focusing on my body language, I'm present. I'm and once I'm present, I cannot be anything else but present. I can't be negative, I can't be doubtful, I can't be happy, I can't be joyful, I can only be present. No emotion can infiltrate the present, the the act of being present, the present if you are focused and concentrated on action within your control, your present, no emotion can infiltrate that. So um, so I have these mental resets ready. Like I was on the my second ocean row from New York to Goa. Um, I had three of them written on the side of my cabin. So the three resets were um, is this quality work? Am I concentrating on an action that's within my control? And uh what was the third one? Um, is this quality work? Am I cancelling an action within my control? And um oh god, it pumped to me. Uh, but anyway, if you think about is this quality work? Like that's a an I the minute I ask myself that question, I I do an audit of my effort. Um, so third controllable is effort. So first one is body position and technique, second one is breath, third one is effort, and fourth one is self-talk. So those four things are always within my control, and I can I can have a mental reset ready for one or all of them. Um, and in this case, on the on the row, is this quality work? Oh, is this quality work? Is my effort honest? And am I concentrating on an action? What's within my control? The minute I ask myself one of those questions, it brings me internally. So, is this quality work? So I do this audit on what I am doing with my body position, my technique, and my efforts. And if I identify, and which I will, of course, if I identify a part that is not to a standard, well, then I'm bringing my concentration to that. Say it's like um I'm sit, I'm slouched, or I'm my lower back is in extension, or I'm I'm not, um, my stroke is short. So the minute I identify that, well, then I start to work on that. So I'm bringing up say a further range of motion into my stroke. So I'm I'm I'm present through my concentrating on an action within my control. And the minute I've done that, I've changed my state. So uh is my effort honest? So I'm auditing my effort, and of course, we'll always see that there's always more. Once we bring our intention, um uh uh intention internally and and and focus on what we're doing, we'll see that you know we're not doing enough. We're with there's more in us, even if I'm trying to row an ocean and I'm 2,000 miles away, I can still put in a little bit more effort right now than I am doing to get to where I want to get to. It doesn't mean I'm gonna start sprinting out of the blocks, right? But I can always do a little bit more in that moment. So so those resets were prepared and they were ready for moments like that, moments that I knew were coming. And um, the quicker I can get out of those moments, firstly, not only do I improve my experience of life, right? Because I'm not sitting in like this negative state of whatever, it could be minor, it could be frustration, could be agitation, or it could be it could be extraordinarily challenging, like this moments of despair. So I can I get I'm changing my experience of what I'm experiencing, so so that's good. And secondly, um I'm uh I'm I'm back in control mentally, and um, and that self-control is really important for uh the outcome we're looking for.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, no, and I appreciate the framework there and the rather the methodology with the four controllables because those are absolutely always within our reach, no matter what's going on, whether it's expected or unexpected. Damien, we could go more in depth on your adventures, but I'd rather just talk about what that looks like for others and the experiences that you create through Iron Mine Institute and ultimately what it feels like to, you know, having gone through these yourself, but ultimately to create that in the lives of others. So why don't we dive into Ironmind, the vision and mission there? And then we talked before we got started about something really exciting you've got coming up uh through that. Uh, believe it's the Masogi experience for a group of folks that have been in for a while. So talk through how you're changing lives uh via experiences.
SPEAKER_00:So um as you can imagine, I'm a big believer in challenge and the power of challenge and um an exploring challenge in our lives and self-imposing challenge. Um that voluntary difficulty, that voluntary adversity, that voluntary struggle, and the extraordinary rewards that are held in that. Um so uh when I came off the back of my second ocean row, I um this was the next place I wanted to go. So I I started the Iron Mind Institute so that I could um dutifully share everything I had like not only learned, but like fashioned and forged at the grindstone of the hardest challenges on the planet, um, and pass that on to others because of its enriching, its empowerment, um its enlightening kind of essence when you are able to um uh control your response to the most debilitating destructive states that um you can um you can self-impose like that is an amazing, amazing power to have as a human, and it translates so well um into life in terms of how you operate. And if you're operating at a higher level today than you were yesterday, well, everyone you rub shoulders with is going to be um uh privileged to experience that, and it's going to actually it's going to have an effect on people because of that energy that you're emitting. So um, and it it all comes down like you know, so if we're challenging ourselves and we're we're we're inducing these moments, so I call them the decisive moment, we're inducing this moment. It's really simple um how we uh control our response to that. Like it's it's not complicated, but it is really hard to do because of the the essence of the experience is is one of you know um disturbance and um compromise, but it really comes down to how you organize your thoughts, just basically what you think about. So that's what we at our essence, that's what we try to train into people. So we put them into compromised um states mentally through challenge, and um we um we guide them out of that through our methodology, through training our methodology, through training or practicing it time and time again and through coaching it. So at the end of these training programs, so we put people through um we have two levels of well, we have three levels of programs. We have a kind of we have what we call an entry level, which is an eight-week training program where we we touch on some of this, and then we have our kind of our signature program, which is a 15-week training program, where at the end of that 15 weeks, the participants in the program take on a 12-hour, a non-stop 12-hour challenge, and that's called Sisu, which is after a Finnish philosophy on how to live life. Um and uh about uh six months ago, we we opened up or well, we invited a small group of people to um our 24-hour crucible challenge, which is called Masogi. And that is about to um happen in November. So it's the first time we're running it. Um and incredibly excited about that. I've been coaching these guys now, as I said, for about six months, and they're coming right to the peak of their preparations, and they're gonna take on a challenge that is uh extraordinarily difficult. Um I'm kind of jealous, and I'm kind of not jealous. You just you know that like it's going to be, you know, I know it's gonna be incredibly difficult. I know they're gonna have uh an amazing experience if they can get through it. But it's it's very much we we so it's it's not just a test of endurance, um, it's a test of much more than that. So we we we do um different kind of energy system training. So they'll do a lot of speed stuff, some sprint stuff, they do some strength work, they do some endure, a lot of endurance stuff. Um so we come at them from all different angles. There's there's parts, so we split this the we split our experience into what we call loops, and each loop has the same sequence. So they prepare, they're introduced to what they're about to do, they prepare mentally for that, or we introduce the mental um the mental prep for that um uh upcoming workout, if you want. Then we we do an RTT, we're ready to train them, then we do the actual training part, and then we do what we call compensation future prep reflection. So we reflect on what we were we just went through, particularly reflecting on the the mental focus that we had for that work, and then what that looked like, what that you know when the when we met the enemy, what happened, and then how can we get better? Um you know, when when you're having these, when we are having these what we call Iron Mine Crucible experiences, like they're there the potential for paradigm shifting uh experiences are off the charts. So if you if you're lucky, you have one or two paradigm shifts a year, right? And that's only if you're somebody who's driven to push themselves. These guys could have seven, eight in an experience, like so. That's why the reflection piece is really important that we link into what may have come about in the chaos of challenge and try and put some semblance of it onto paper that will help accelerate any learning and any uh clarity around that that we can get there. So that's why we have that reflection piece. So we have one loop where we call it a chaos loop, and um, it's a body of work where they have no idea what's coming and they have no idea when it ends, relatively like obviously they know at some point it's gonna end, but you know, that doesn't help them at all when they're in the maelstrom of the work, like and when it's coming at them, and they their mind is just gonna go to a place where we want it to go to, which is like outside of any type of control, and then we're gonna guide them back into it. And what we're trying to do through that guidance is for them to build the association. Well, well, okay, when I focused on that, I felt this in that moment, and that changed right my experience. And when I was thinking about that, or I was thinking about when this is going to be over, I felt like this, and then when I focused on something else, you know, I felt something different. So you're trying to get them to build that association, and like it's like uh I like to think of it as a kind of a spider web, you know, neurologically. And the first time you make it, it's this really thin sliver, but the connection is made, and if you can have the same experience again, you add another sliver to it, and then over time, if you keep having that experience, it becomes stronger and stronger and stronger and stronger, and the the connection becomes stronger, so like that information passes in your brain uh much quicker. So, um, so yeah, that's what we're trying to teach, and that's where we're trying to do it, and that's how we do it through those what we call well, firstly, the training program, which is incredibly important, and then what we call crucible experiences. Like crucible is like a forge, it's like where they you know, where they used to uh the um uh melt and form uh new um substances, so like you can think of it as this ready red hot forge as it happens in your mind, it becomes red hot, it becomes malleable, and uh and you can make change through paradigm shifts.
SPEAKER_02:Damien, do you find that most folks that you get to work with as it relates to the to the mental component of this, that most of the work is or a fair portion of work is spent uncovering false narratives that they've formed from a very young age and perhaps they've been carrying since their childhood, whether they're aware of the narrative or unaware of the narrative.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, for sure. Um those limiting beliefs or disempowering beliefs uh pop up all the time. Um and it's mostly in conversation, you know. So when we're the way we our programs are set out, we do reviews, we call them performance reviews, but basically we go back into some numbers um from their um from the training block. And you know, we're what we're trying to do is show them the progress they've made because it can be difficult sometimes, particularly with the way um the machines that we use, the experience of using them is is one of um uh it's one of negativity because it's the training is so hard, so we can build negative associations. So what we try and do at the end of a training cycle is go back in and and get them real clarity on how far they've come and induce some positive energy from that so they can kick on into the next cycle. So when you're having that conversation uh with those with the participants at that time, we we we often um experience like these uh beliefs that come up. Um, thankfully for us, it comes up in a positive light because they have broken through something through the work, you know, by by uh leveraging the four controllables, they're able to get past some type of negativity. That in itself is an eye-opening experience, like and it changes people's perspective, it changes their beliefs, and that's what we're trying to do, right? So, you know, we talk a lot about um the the outcomes of what we want here are like are really like metaphysical, like they're things like self-respect, self-worth, self-belief, self-trust. You know, I put myself into this situation. It was extraordinarily hard. Every cell in my body wanted was telling me to go the other way, to give up, to quit, to relent, to slow down. But I control that moment and I was able to change my experience and then able to kick on. And that is when people have that experience, like they're like, Well, I mean, if I can do that, I can why I can do that again and again. So they're they're creating these paradigm shifts and they're getting past their own limiting beliefs. Um, and then they're on the path, right?
SPEAKER_02:Right, that's beautiful. It's self-mastery and self-discovery, I believe, or it is a beautiful experience within itself in couple when coupled with a challenge or a set of challenges to the body and mind like what better way to live life. And it's something that that doesn't end because there's always something that we can learn about ourselves and then use that in turn to help others. Damien, I want to talk about briefly your upcoming adventure. You're you're not a runner by trade, but it's certainly served you well in your rugby career, and from the time that you decided to go and run on the pitch for 30 days straight in 2026, you are destined to run laps around Ireland. I'm not sure the exact distance, but with the mission and goal of raising 1 million euros for charity. So the 1 million euro run, I believe, is what you've tokened it. Talk through that and how we can support that uh as well uh so that you can achieve your your goal in 2026.
SPEAKER_00:Well no, uh when I came off the um North Atlantic Grove to Galway, it was like uh amazing, amazing and amazing adventure on on every level. But it was the cup was really like, I mean, bone dry. And uh and I like to give that cup some time to kind of replenish. And it actually took the guts of maybe two and a half years before I felt um the the energy was back that I could take on another like challenge, and it you know, it had to be something that was I'm not interested in going over all ground, it had to be something that was going to challenge me to a level like I've never been challenged before. And and I was trying to think of ways of doing that here in Ireland because um, you know, I I have uh two daughters, four and two, and uh the thought had been away for like whatever, four or five. Like I was four and a half months away from home on the North Atlantic Row. Um, and and that just wasn't something I was willing to do. So I was starting to think of things and how can my family be close to me and I will do something that is meaningful, purposeful, um, and full of service as well. Because as I mentioned, kind of that's where I'm at, I suppose, in life to a certain extent. And uh and over time, this vision started to form that I could, well, if I'm gonna do it in Ireland, um I could try running again. So I'd done a lot of since I did the mountain de sable in 2016, I'd done a lot of mountaineering and ocean rowing, but I was kind of drawn back to the running because I knew as well, like there was nothing going to challenge me as much as running. Like I'm you know, as I said, I I wouldn't I wouldn't class myself as any type of runner. I'm like I'm six foot six foot five, two hundred and seventy pounds kind of now. So, like, you know, uh don't see that body type in many other intrinsics. Not a whole lot. No. Um so uh so yeah, where's the challenge gonna come? The challenge gonna come in the the um the brutality of running day after day after day for what I see to be three, three and a half thousand kilometers, depending on the route. Um, but that's where it all came from, yeah. Just so so I want to challenge myself. It has to be like uh if it's not gonna challenge me, I'm not interested. So that's big time where the challenge is. And then, well, you know, where's the service in it? Well, there's many arms of that. I suppose that the big kind of glaring one is like I want to raise a million euros for charity, but it's more than that, it's like connecting with people every single day as I go. Like, so you know, we'll have either it's yet to be decided, but either five or 10k every morning is open. Anyone can come and join in and run that five or 10k with me. Um so like you you can literally connect with people, rub shoulders with them, you know, go through an experience with them, and and that is something like that. Is it's not it's not the be-all and end all, but it is full of something, it is full of something that I want to bring to the world, right? Um, so that so that that that is a big part of it in terms of you know connecting with I I I see it as an almost an ode to the country that has given given me so much, like that the life I have had the privilege to lead and live is um is so much down to the country I grew up in, the family I grew up in, the institutions I was I was connected to their and and um touched by their culture uh and the people and the spirit and the um the community of Ireland. So I I want to give back as much as I can to that because I am incredibly grateful for it. Um so uh so yeah, that's it really in a nutshell, try to run a lap around the country and you know um and raise a million euro for charity at the same time.
SPEAKER_02:That's beautiful, Damien. I have a new closing tradition on the podcast, and it's to ask high performers what winning means to them. Because one thing that I've learned over the years interviewing high performers is that winning isn't so much outcome-based as it is a more likely to be aligned to values or something deeper than winning equals a bank figure or winning equals this. So I'm gonna pose that to you. What is winning uh to you?
SPEAKER_00:It is um self-realization and inner peace. So it's to make the most of my time, energy, and effort to three things that are finite, uh, they'll all run out someday, and when they do, I want to be able to contently feel you know, I gave this thing everything I had. I tried my best. Whether I was soaring or in the gutter, every day I got up and I tried my best. I tried to move the needle a little bit in being a better human, in connecting with others, in um in knowing myself a little bit better, um, in um coaching people, in touching people in any way I can, and inducing energy in somebody so that they can go after whatever is important to them in life. Um so that's the the potential piece, trying to make the most of my time, energy, and effort. And then if I feel if um I challenge myself enough and deeply enough, um I I get to know myself on levels that are um are unknown, like on until you go into them, you didn't know that was part of you, or you didn't see it, or you didn't feel it. Um so if I keep challenging myself, if I keep pushing myself and unveiling those levels, like peeling away those layers of an onion, um eventually, I mean you can feel it. You get these um you get this internal freedom from having a map, a very clear and detailed and broad and deep map of who you are as a human, and that brings inner peace. You know, you you you have nothing to hide because from yourself, you're not hiding away internally, you're not letting fear dictate your life. You're living this honest, courageous experience that um that unveils these levels to you, and then if you experience them enough, you know, even if they're levels you don't enjoy like and don't like about yourself, over time you can do something about that, or you can accept it as somebody, a part of you, and that's that know thyself piece. Um, and that's that that in itself, the deeper you know yourself, the more peace you have in how you live every day. So that's it. Self-realization and inner peace.
SPEAKER_02:That's captivating. If I asked you that question a decade or two ago, do you believe that would still be your response?
SPEAKER_00:I wouldn't have been able to articulate it. I I would have been operating out of a similar space, but not, you know, again, I wouldn't have said that the the drive probably wouldn't have been as deep because I wouldn't have had as uh many experiences that would have brought the humility and understanding and clarity that I now have. Um but I would have felt it for sure. I I think I locked into that really early in life. I feel I've always had a good feel for life and what's important. Um, but I wouldn't have been able to articulate it. I probably would have, and I wouldn't have had the um I wouldn't have had the self-understanding to or the self-confidence to to admit that I didn't know how to say it. And I probably would have made up some, you know, shitty answer.
SPEAKER_02:Well, appreciate the honesty there. I have two elevator questions, meaning that the amount of time to respond to the question is the amount of time it takes to go up one elevator floor. The first one is we're in an elevator, we're going to grab a uh breakfast somewhere cool in Ireland, and someone gets in, they recognize you, and they they say, Damien, what's one step that I can take today to forge an iron mind or start that process?
SPEAKER_00:What are you avoiding? Um, and the first thing the first thing we get past is here, right? So what are you avoiding? And then I point them, but how can you do one thing today, one small step to move towards that thing?
SPEAKER_02:Ed Milet is one of my favorite authors and speakers, and one thing I that stands out from him is he says, on the other side of pain, or on the other side of the things we don't want to do, or on the other side of what we may be avoiding is the best version of ourselves or a better version of us. The last one, Damien, is what's one book that we can read this year or in the coming year to sharpen our mindset?
SPEAKER_00:I really enjoyed a book called Um Unbeatable Mind by um Mark Devine, Captain Mark Devine, I think, from he was a Navy SEAL uh in San Diego. Yeah, Unbeatable Mind's a really good book around all things, all the mind, challenging yourself, pushing yourself.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, Mark is great, great podcast too. Damien, how how do we keep up with you and what's the best way that we can show you love and support?
SPEAKER_00:Um I'm pretty active on uh social media, Instagram. Um, so my handle is at owlstock a U L D underscore stock S T O C K. Yeah, it's uh an old Irish term of endearment that I I love. And uh yeah, that's probably the best test.
SPEAKER_02:Alright, yeah, I highly recommend giving Damien a follow there. He is indeed very active, and I love when you post the stories of chop wood, carry water. And it's a good reminder to people if you see that that to get your butt moving and don't many don't make any excuses. Damien, this was an honor. Really loved you sharing your experiences and your relentless and endless pursuit of challenges. It was really inspiring to hear that you didn't just set out on a challenging journey once and then hang your hat on it. You've really turned it into a vocation that by you choosing hard, you then forge the way for others to choose hard and ultimately see that they can go further and harder than they believed possible. And I believe that's what we got today. And it's my wish that our conversation served as an invitation for people to forge an iron mind of their own and win today. Thank you so much.
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